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Post by jimmydickens on Dec 29, 2017 12:34:02 GMT -5
Ken cal interviews the devils radio guy and that guy revealed an interesting thing: the devils collapse had a lot to do with Lou Lams holding onto talent via nothing more than loyalty. And he sees Ken Holland doing the same thing now.
The GM is where this starts. You can’t tank and still make money in Detroit, otherwise I believe that route would have already happened. But you need a GM today who doesn’t hoard. The coach will always do the best he can with what’s on the ice, but unless you’ve got Babcock, you’re not getting trash into the post season
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Post by PierreC on Jan 4, 2018 9:18:28 GMT -5
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Post by number13 on Jan 4, 2018 11:57:40 GMT -5
This is unfortunate really. If we want to really rebuild we need fresh blood starting with the GM down to the coach and system coach wants to utilize. We haven't really had much injury this season but that along with player slumping was the excuse for the playoff streak ending. We're pretty much in the exact place as last season...pushing mediocrity! I'm hoping Blashill is realizing its the kids that are going to get the job done and rid the Larkin, Mantha and Athanasiou train, reduce roles and minutes of Hank and Kronner.
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wedge
New Member
Posts: 20
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Post by wedge on Jan 19, 2018 12:16:52 GMT -5
I don't think there is any way Holland is around next year. Chris Illitch is probably wanting to put his stamp on the organization sooner or later. Holland's departure would herald of that change.
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Post by jimmydickens on Jan 23, 2018 17:29:45 GMT -5
I know Chris illitch has a sense of history. But, he put Al Avila at the Tigers helm to refocus the team around pitching and defense and restock the system. That naturally gets payroll under control. If he wasn’t ok with the Red Wings headed the same direction, then Holland would have just been fired.
Only way Ken Holland stays with Detroit is if no one else is there.
The legacy speaks for itself. His strategy became the model for building a team in the cap era but he quickly got surpassed by GMs unafraid to make a mistake and now the team looks as average as they did back in the late 80s/early 90s when the Yzerman-Lidstrom run was at its earliest stages.
Good things this year: Daley is a good pickup but they still don’t have much of anything besides Mike Green. You’re averaging a bunch more goals with just one more guy as good as Green.
I also say Witkowski is a good pickup. Why Blashill wouldn’t use Ott last tear is a mystery but he’s using Witkowski and that helps. You just need more, particularly guys like him who can get more minutes. Perhaps Bertuzzi is the next one if he gets to stick
Keeping Athanasiou. He got the deal done. Athanasiou, Larkin and Mantha might not all be in the Jersey in 5 years but they’re the new generation.
Holland won’t fire Blashill cuz he never fired Lewis. Todd Nelson is doing just as well in the AHL with fewer pieces though. The only GM names coming around in circles are rookie GMs
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Post by chris on Jan 28, 2018 8:49:49 GMT -5
Holland is GM and Executive Vice President. Maybe they bring in a new GM and find something else for Holland to do as EVP.
I thought they did "fire" Lewis? From Wikipedia:
" Dave Lewis was named head coach of the Red Wings. In two seasons, he guided the Red Wings to two 48-win campaigns, including a Presidents' Trophy. In the playoffs, however, he had a record of 6–10. After the lockout ended, his contract was allowed to expire on June 30, 2005"
I think the events forthcoming in the next 6 months or so will be very telling of where Holland's head is at. If both Helm and Abby are still around for sure someone needs to show Holland the door.
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Post by number13 on Jan 28, 2018 11:18:37 GMT -5
I'm one to think we're not as bad of a team as we show. I think we have some decent pieces of the puzzle but we have a coach who doesn't know how to put the right pieces of the puzzle together. Yes Holland made some bad deals, overpaying, panic signing and handing out longer term contracts. He is the boss so he needs to take some of the blame for recent failures. I thought Blashill should have been fired after last season. Holland was lying to himself thinking last season was because of injuries and few players paid to score had off seasons. Sure we had some of that but coach has to take blame on the personnel usage-- and who employs the coach and who did NOT fire him? Kenny Holland! Even carrying on with the same ole same ole but coach Blashill should have been fired by mid November as the pattern is exactly the same as last season and that is a crappy personnel choices by the coach. To me that is two strikes against KH. if he won't fire Blashill this season or in the off season he too should be fired for not having any balls or backbone.
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Post by jimmydickens on Jan 29, 2018 18:24:30 GMT -5
www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/2018/01/red_wings_trade_possibilities.html#incart_river_indexTrade list which as usual, places no value on any red wing except mike green. While there is no rule that says you can’t re-sign a guy you traded away the season before, last season Holland merely moved role players off the squad. It’s the NHL trade deadline next. Ken Holland will again only move role players with which there’s already a comparable piece in the system. So that’s somebody in defense and bottom six forwards.
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Post by PierreC on Jan 30, 2018 0:51:19 GMT -5
since we are no deep on defense and the farm is thin, i wouldn't mind resigning Green..but not at 6 and more, something he won't accept.
He said he likes it here..but he prefers money and he will get it somewhere else.
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Post by PierreC on Jan 30, 2018 0:52:16 GMT -5
well the farm isnt that thin, Hicketts and Kronek will eventually crack the line-up, probably next season. But none of them are top pairing Ds.
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Post by number13 on Jan 30, 2018 8:52:32 GMT -5
I agree, I'd take Green back but not at 6 million/yr. Green is better defensively than I gave him credit for but then again he was int eh east and I really didnt see a whole hell of a lot of him and when I did it was all offensive. He's a good player but if we offer him anything it will be low balled and Green will laugh it off I won't hold anything against him wanting a payday...he's earned it and doesn't have a lot of time left to play so he should stock up on cash
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Post by jimmydickens on Jan 30, 2018 13:32:58 GMT -5
You know, the other reason I don’t think Holland will move Green unless the deal is amazing, John Carlsson is the only ofther significant D going to free agency and he’s only a little more valuable than Green. You get Green twice over, you’re at least scoring more goals. That with a mentally tougher team you maybe win a handful more games.
That would require some contracts to go away though. The Islanders need a better goalie and Arizona needs any goalie. Those are the biggest contracts to move, but Arizona has a history of absorbing cap hits.
Who is the new chelios though? Do you keep Ericsson or Jronwall just to veteran Hicketts?
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Post by PierreC on Jan 30, 2018 23:33:23 GMT -5
You know, the other reason I don’t think Holland will move Green unless the deal is amazing, John Carlsson is the only ofther significant D going to free agency and he’s only a little more valuable than Green. You get Green twice over, you’re at least scoring more goals. That with a mentally tougher team you maybe win a handful more games. That would require some contracts to go away though. The Islanders need a better goalie and Arizona needs any goalie. Those are the biggest contracts to move, but Arizona has a history of absorbing cap hits. Who is the new chelios though? Do you keep Ericsson or Jronwall just to veteran Hicketts? There is no way Green stays in D. KH won't risk losing him for Nothing this summer. The only way Green doesn't get traded is if he gets extended... Do they negociate ??.. i don't think so... so...
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Post by jimmydickens on Feb 10, 2018 21:54:37 GMT -5
If there were any players in the system you could use them Green would have been moved already. You have to wonder because Holland knows that he’s got no one capable of getting the puck up the ice if he moves Green. That goes back to the forwards job and the last 3 years we saw that doesn’t work if you’re trying to score and win games.
It would also seem more likely Ken Holland can sign a good veteran defenseman if he still has Green on the roster.. Maybe even get Enstrom or Carlsson. That helps a lot because if you really thought Hicketts or even Russo, who just continues to rack up assists at the AHL level, we’re ready then why are Jensen and Ouellette on the roster?
It’s also any day now that Zetterberg or Kronwall or both call it a day and injured reserve isn’t there to save you from cap recapture penalties.
With the obvious considerations, I think Ken Holland only moves Green if he believes this is going to take 3, 4 or 5 years to just get back into post season shape. In that time, Larkin, Mantha and Athanasiou might not even be Red Wings
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Post by PierreC on Feb 21, 2018 2:30:19 GMT -5
Is Schevnikov a bust ?
Evgeny Svechnikov RW GR 46 7 11 18 -3
Only 7 goals, Turgeon has 13, Russo 7...
Humm...
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